Commons:Deletion requests/Files in Category:Plan 9 from Outer Space

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This deletion discussion is now closed. Please do not make any edits to this archive. You can read the deletion policy or ask a question at the Village pump. If the circumstances surrounding this file have changed in a notable manner, you may re-nominate this file or ask for it to be undeleted.

Files in Category:Plan 9 from Outer Space

[edit]

VRT agent (verify): ticket:2020062210010809. Claim of copyright renewal has been supplied, and claim of PD due to non-renewal should be deemed not to be true. Deletion was requested over OTRS. Starting discussion here.

Copyright registered 1981-04-23 (PA 102-338).
Copyright renewed on 1986-01-06 (RE 279 707).

--Jonatan Svensson Glad (talk) 22:40, 22 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Internet Archives claims that the copyright renewal was legally invalid for these reasons. See [1], so should  Keep. --Jonatan Svensson Glad (talk) 22:51, 22 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
The above link is now dead, so for others' reference/convenience here's an archival link—this is also the source for the blockquote below. Brandt Luke Zorn (talk) 23:43, 14 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  •  Keep Per internet Archive

    COPYRIGHT NOTICE

    From Video-Cellar: This film is in the public domain. “Grave Robbers From Outer Space” was originally published in the USA in 1959. The film was not immediately registered for copyright. It was registered by it's producer “Reynolds Pictures Inc.” in 1981 (PA0000102338).

    The film's copyright was renewed in 1986 by Wade Williams 3 (RE0000279707). In 1981, Williams lodged a quitclaim from Kathy Wood (Edward D. Wood Jr.'s second wife [1956-his death] and heir. USCO doc. no. V1831P045) and separate quitclaims of interest from Norma McCarty (Edward D. Wood Jr.'s first wife - falsely listed on the filing as “Mrs. Edward D. Wood, Jr., successor of all rights to the Estate of Edward D. Wood, Jr.”, which she was not, as their marriage had been annulled) - and Reynolds Pictures, Inc.

    This renewal was legally invalid for these reasons:

    1) The registration and renewals were lodged providing the incorrect title on screen, date-in-notice and publication date for the original publication.

    2) In order for a successor in interest to renew a copyright they have to demonstrate that they own the copyright through a valid transfer of rights from the party owning the copyright at or immediately before the renewal window. None of the parties Mr. Williams sought quitclaims from were valid owners of copyright immediately prior to the renewal window. Valid copyright successors for this film “James Flocker Enterprises Inc.”, “Gold Key Video”, "Vidtronics Inc.”, and “Medallion Pictures”, all companies who are successors in the chain of ownership post registration, are not present in Williams' quitclaims. Williams has, instead, provided the USCO with a series of meaningless assignments from parties which no longer held any copyright interest in the work in order to demonstrate “ownership” of the intellectual property in the film.

    The screenplay was further registered as an unpublished work in 1989 (Pau001211635). This again is rendered legally invalid by the mere fact that large portions of the screenplay were previously published as part of the registered motion picture for which no valid copyright renewal exists.

    Beyond My Ken (talk) 23:24, 22 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  •  Keep No valid copyright renewal, as explained in full by Beyond My Ken above. JoJo Anthrax (talk) 02:46, 23 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  •  Keep This film is in the public domain. Terraflorin (talk) 07:49, 23 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  •  Delete Given that Internet Archive is facing some "issues" currently over it's "liberal" interpretation of what copyright policy allows, I think Commons should treat a reasonable deletion request over OTRS as valid. Was the OTRS request from one of the parties named in the Copyright Office records? ShakespeareFan00 (talk) 09:15, 23 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Apples and oranges, their current issues are not at all related to this. It's like saying that the US can't settle a fishing rights problem in Nova Scotia with Canada because it's in the middle of a trade war with China. Different things altogether.Beyond My Ken (talk) 01:55, 26 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  •  Keep, no reason provided why the OTRS request would be valid. After Distributors Corporation of America folded, the film was released in 1959 by Valient Pictures which did not file for copyright protection but distributed it under a states' right basis [2]. The PD rationale is not a lack of renewal but a lack of notice. — Racconish 💬 11:23, 23 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  •  Keep So, published in 1959 without notice, with a 1981 registration by someone who didn't actually establish that they owned the rights to the work? It's hard to see how that's anything other than public domain. --Tronvillain (talk) 20:56, 23 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    • Wait... the film was published with the copyright attributed to Reynolds Pictures Inc., 1958? And the registration for "Plan 9 from outer space / written, produced, directed by Edward D. Wood, Jr." (listed under "Title") with publication date 1958-05-01 in 1981 (PA0000102338 / 1981-04-23) was by "Reynolds Pictures, Inc., employer for hire", right? And then there's V1989P337, assignment of copyright for "Plan nine from outer space : a.k.a. Grave robbers from outer space; motion picture" from "Mrs. Edward D. Wood, Jr., successor of all rights to the Estate of Edward D. Wood, Jr. & Reynolds Pictures, Inc." to "Wade Williams 3d" (apparently the marriage to Norma McCarty was never annulled, though the current source for that on Wikipedia is... Wade Williams by way of the Hollywood Reporter); as well as V1831P045, an agreement between Kathy Wood and Wade H. Williams 3d about "Plan nine from outer space : a.k.a. Grave robbers from outer space; motion picture / By Edward D. Wood, Jr. DCR 1957." Then there's the renewal (RE0000278774 / 1986-01-06) for "Plan nine from outer space. By Reynolds Pictures, Inc" (PA0000112906 / 1958-04-03) by Wade H. Williams III (PWH). As the above essay says, neither the registration nor the renewal use the on-screen title (Plan 9 from Outer Space), and the registration and renewal date appear to have different publication dates (1958-05-01 versus 1958-04-03). Then there's whether or not Reynolds Pictures owned the rights in 1981 and whether Kathy Wood and Norma McCarty were the ones with the power to transfer the rights from Reynolds Pictures to Wade Williams, but I'm not clear how the quoted essay established that. --Tronvillain (talk) 23:04, 23 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  •  Comment Looks like the IA page for the film was taken down. Does anyone know why? -- King of ♥ ♦ ♣ ♠ 04:34, 8 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  •  Delete All of these rights (including Internet Archive has been deleted for copyright reasons) belonged to various owners, since copyright has been renewed. It would wait for another 35 years until it is public domain in 2055, by the rule of shorter term. --122.2.10.69 03:11, 3 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • OTRS I have posed an inquiry to the Internet Archive in Ticket:2020090310001055. -- King of ♥ ♦ ♣ ♠ 03:33, 3 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  •  Comment Even assuming the film remains under copyright, that would have no bearing on the copyright status of several of the files listed above. The film is at issue, and the screenshots are clear derivative works of the film, but these files are not derivative works of the film:

Kept: Per discussion. --Ellin Beltz (talk) 19:32, 28 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

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