Talk:Q1152
Autodescription — Auvergne (Q1152)
- Useful links:
- View it! – Images depicting the item on Commons
- Report on constraint conformation of “Auvergne” claims and statements. Constraints report for items data
- See also
- This documentation is generated using
{{Item documentation}}.
Ancienne province du royaume de France
[edit]Bonjour Hadrianus. Si le libellé est « ancienne province du royaume de France », la nature de l'élément ne peut pas être « région française » dont la date de dissolution est le 31 décembre 2015. Rien ne renvoie ici à l'ancienne province moderne, d'où ma modification. Cordialement, --CptKeyes (talk) 13:53, 20 May 2022 (UTC)
- Bonjour CptKeyes. Le libellé "ancienne région administrative" correspond à un autre élément : Région Auvergne (Q24082791). Il faut bien sûr reporter là-bas les deux mentions en nature de l'élément qui ne conviennent pas. Ceci dit, si tu préfères mettre (ou ajouter) "région historique de France", cela me convient très bien et ce serait probablement plus cohérent avec beaucoup des interwikis. Cordialement. Hadrianus (talk) 16:26, 20 May 2022 (UTC)
- Bonsoir Hadrianus. Je n'avais pas noté l'existence de Q24082791, merci pour ce signalement ! Je vais essayer de transférer certaines choses pour ne pas faire doublon. Je corrige en « région historique de France » comme tu le proposes. Cordialement, --CptKeyes (talk) 19:31, 21 May 2022 (UTC)
What should be the relationship between these entities:
- Auvergne (Q1152) French cultural region
- Auvergne (Q24082791) administrative region of France (1956-2015)
I had added a claim Auvergne (Q1152)replaces (P1365)Auvergne (Q24082791), which VIGNERON thought was "obviously wrong". I was thinking along the lines of demographics of Auvergne (Q3044198), which was about demographics of Auvergne (Q24082791), but now is about demographics of Auvergne (Q1152). What's left when a political territorial entity (Q1048835) ceases to exist? Frequently, it lives on in a cultural region (Q3502482), as Auvergne (Q1152) did for Auvergne (Q1193946): French province (?-1790). I thought replaces (P1365) was a reasonable way to model this, but perhaps there are better ways I haven't thought of. To be clear, I don't mean to imply that Auvergne (Q1152) didn't exist until 2015. Daask (talk) 23:14, 14 February 2024 (UTC)
- Hi Daask,
- Thanks for raising this question. For me, Auvergne (Q1152) has never ceased to exist. It has been there for centuries and still exists today (in both case informally since it never had any legal existence). So, chronologically, it's both after and before the other one, hence why I said that replaces (P1365) was "obviously wrong". Also, P1365 is use to link entities of the same type (a country replaced by a country, a city replaced by a city, etc.), it feels very weird to use it between a cultural territory and a political division.
- That said, sadly, I don't have any obvious answer to your question. Maybe territory overlaps (P3179)?
- PS: We have other items for the former political division (County of Auvergne (Q15043149), Duchy of Auvergne (Q3622479), Dauphiné d'Auvergne (Q3017070) and many more) that should also be improved and linked together.
- Cdlt, VIGNERON (talk) 07:43, 15 February 2024 (UTC)