User talk:Georgejdorner

The fun has fled Wikipedia. And so have I.

/User page: The brag wall
/User page: Dab notices
/User page: The Bugle
/User page: Work Area 1
/User page: Work Area 2
/User page: Work Area 3
/User page: Work Area 4
/User page: Work Area 5
/User page: Work Area 6
/Archive: Aces
/Archive: List of WWI aces
/Archive: Wiki editing
/Archive: General bumf

My self-assigned task of creating bio pages for all notable World War I flying aces is now complete, with 939 new biographies of various lengths created.

DYK Nomination process

Hi. I've nominated Frank Linke-Crawford, an article you worked on, for consideration to appear on the Main Page as part of Wikipedia:Did you know. You can see the hook for the article here, where you can improve it if you see fit.

George, the DYK nomination process is not as complicated as it looks. See my example above. - Canglesea (talk) 10:47, 26 December 2008 (UTC)

DYK for Clive Franklyn Collett

Thank you for your contribution to the wiki Victuallers (talk) 00:03, 28 January 2011 (UTC)

DYK nomination of William Stanley Jenkins

Hello! Your submission of William Stanley Jenkins at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and there still are some issues that may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! Yoninah (talk) 10:32, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

I do not accept your withdrawal of the article—it's too good to pass up! I formatted the references for you. However, one reference, "aerodrome", is a malicious link. Do you have another link that verifies the information? Also, please add some categories to the article so it's complete for DYK. Thanks, Yoninah (talk) 19:03, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

When I clicked on the link, a page came up saying that it was a malicious link and I was denied access. Perhaps I have a better firewall on my computer than yours? Anyway, if you can get into the link, please write the citation as follows: <ref>{{cite web |url= |title= |date= |accessdate= |publisher= }}</ref>. Thanks, Yoninah (talk) 22:43, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

Yes, please copy the information into the format and plug it into the article where you're citing it as a reference. Thanks, Yoninah (talk) 21:00, 2 February 2011 (UTC)

DYK for William Stanley Jenkins

Materialscientist (talk) 18:04, 13 February 2011 (UTC)

Milhist FA, A-Class and Peer Reviews Jan-Mar 2011

		Military history reviewers' award
		By order of the Military history WikiProject coordinators, for your help with the WikiProject's Peer and A-Class reviews for the period Jan-Mar 2011, I hereby award you this Military history WikiProject Reviewers' award. Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 12:34, 3 April 2011 (UTC) Keep track of upcoming reviews. Just copy and paste {{WPMILHIST Review alerts}} to your user space

DYK for Clement W. Payton

Thanks from me and the DYK project Victuallers (talk) 18:02, 2 May 2011 (UTC)

DYK for Jean Alfred Fraissinet

Materialscientist (talk) 00:03, 13 November 2011 (UTC)

Flying Ace

Hi. According to the book "Iranian F-14 Tomcat Units In Comabat, by Tom Cooper and Farzad Bishop" Jalil Zandi's shoot-downs are:

• First: 15 May 81.
• Second: Jan 1982.
• Third: 10 Oct 1982.
• Fourth: 10 Oct 1982.
• Fifth: Sept 1983.
• Sixth: Sept 1983
• Seventh: Apr 1986
• eighth: Apr 1986
• ninth: Aug 1987
• tenth: Feb 1988
• eleventh: Feb 1988</ref>

Diako Zandi 09:37, 29 December 2012 (UTC)

Discussion on the AFT5 Request for Comment

Hey Georgejdorner - this is to notify you that there is a discussion starting on the Article Feedback RfC talkpage that has ramifications for the RfC itself. Your input is much appreciated :). Thanks! and apologies if I've missed anyone Okeyes (WMF) (talk) 16:40, 28 January 2013 (UTC)

The Fokker Scourge page

I spent a lot of (off-line) time and effort getting this rewritten - I really do think it is a better article now than the one that a certain person reverted it to. BUT could you have a look at my latest version and his (lord only knows which will be "up" when you look) and let us know what you think. I'm NOT trying to corral support, just to get a few third opinions, as I scent an on-coming edit war over this one.--Soundofmusicals (talk) 12:38, 16 March 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for having a look, and your kind comments. Hopefully the "other party" will now feel able to express genuine concerns (if he has them) with constructive comments and edits rather than reversion to crap. --Soundofmusicals (talk) 23:10, 16 March 2013 (UTC)

May 2013

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Love history & culture? Get involved in WikiProject World Digital Library!

World Digital Library Wikipedia Partnership - We need you!

Hi Georgejdorner! I'm the Wikipedian In Residence at the World Digital Library, a project of the Library of Congress and UNESCO. I'm recruiting Wikipedians who are passionate about history & culture to participate in improving Wikipedia using the WDL's vast free online resources. Participants can earn our awesome WDL barnstar and help to disseminate free knowledge from over 100 libraries in 7 different languages. Please sign up to participate here. Thanks for editing Wikipedia and I look forward to working with you! SarahStierch (talk) 00:34, 23 May 2013 (UTC)

Hey George! I'm so happy to see you signed up to join the project - welcome. You can dive into our to-do lists here. I think we might have some aviators tossed in there someplace...Be sure to watchlist your favorites, as they will continue to grow as new content gets added to the WDL website. Also, you can always search i.e. "World War I" or "aviator" in the WDL website for something that you're interested in. And be sure to share your outcomes here. If I can help with anything just ask and welcome aboard! SarahStierch (talk) 20:25, 23 May 2013 (UTC)

Zähringer Lion

Hi George - I saw you setting up this category, and wanted to let you know that the "a" in Zahringer should have an umlaut (per House of Zähringen). Regards, Parsecboy (talk) 16:45, 3 June 2013 (UTC)

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Thanks for the heads-up, Parsecboy.

Georgejdorner (talk) 16:57, 3 June 2013 (UTC)

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Oh, hey, I just found that Category:Order of the Zähringer Lion was created some time ago. Might want to keep that in mind for future use. Parsecboy (talk) 20:03, 7 June 2013 (UTC)

World Digital Library-Wikimedia Partnership Newsletter

Expand Wikipedia's free knowledge with WDL resources!

Hi Georgejdorner! Thanks for participating in the World Digital Library-Wikimedia Partnership. Your contributions are important to improving Wikipedia! I wanted to share a few updates with you:

• We have an easy way to now cite WDL resources. You can learn more about it on our news page, here.
• Our to-do list is being expanded and features newly digitized and created resources from libraries and archives around the world, including content from Sweden, Qatar, the Library of Congress, and more! You can discover new content for dissemination here.
• WDL project has new userbox for you to post on your userpage and celebrate your involvement. Soffredo created it, so please be sure to thank them on their talk page. You can find the userbox and add it to your page here.
• Our first batch of WDL barnstars have been awarded! Congratulations to our first recipients: ProtoplasmaKid, ChrisGualtieri, TenthEagle, Rhyswynne, Luwii, Sosthenes12, Djembayz, Parkwells, Carl Francis, Yunshui, MrX, Pharaoh of the Wizards, and the prolific Yster76!! Thank you for your contributions and keep up the great work. Be sure to share your article expansions and successes here.

Keep up the great work, and please contact me if you need anything! Thank you for all you do for free knowledge! EdwardsBot (talk) 16:35, 30 June 2013 (UTC)

July 2013

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• Voss was both slightly wounded and forced down on 6 June 1917 by Flt Sub-Lt [[Christopher Draper]]) of that squadron, but soon returned to duty.<ref>Franks 2000, p. 13.</ref> On 30 July, Voss moved

Thanks, BracketBot (talk) 01:30, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

RE:Gottfried Freiherr von Banfield‎;

I was waiting for that inquiry from you. So first of all I didn't add any (dead or not) link to the article. Second of all:

• Yes I'm 100% sure. Imagine the pre-WW and inter-WW era amateur tennis life. Amateurism - that is no financial benefit could be gained from tennis - was characterized and dominated by nobility, who could afford the costs of international tennis competitions. Traveling, racquets, courts fees, a problem that is nowadays solved by professionalism where each and every of these are sponsored. It was a blueblood hobby. Some examples, I've created/contributed recently : Count Ludwig von Salm-Hoogstraeten, Count Mikhail Sumarokov-Elston (Russian Royal Family scion), Don Rodrigo de Castro Pereira (Portugese Royal family scion), Edward Murray Colston, 2nd Baron Roundway, George Cholmondeley, 5th Marquess of Cholmondeley, Wollmar Boström (Swedish minister) and also aviators/flying aces Constantin Cantacuzino (aviator) and Roland Garros (aviator). Heck even Miklós Horthy, WWII governor of the Kingdom of Hungary won tournaments at the Adriatic (sources for that in the Rolf Kinzl article).
• The links I've included in my edit summaries all shows Baron Goffredo de Banfield, his Italian name as an Italian pre-WWII competitor in e.g. Wimbledon, which according to his wikipedia article here is correct, he switched to Italian nationality around 1926. Do you know any other Gottfried who was the Baron of Banfield, who lived at the same time and had the same noble rank and was also Italian? Lajbi ^{Holla @ me • CP} 16:36, 28 July 2013 (UTC)

The dead link could be an unintentional side-effect of my revert so feel free to remove it. If I'll have time I will add some info on his tennis career as you requested. Lajbi ^{Holla @ me • CP} 19:36, 28 July 2013 (UTC)

That's him on the website of the Triest Tennis Club. It mentions that he won the closed championships in Triest in 1927. There's also a picture of him that perfectly matches the one in the article. So a brief sentence could be easily added that he was an Italian tennis champion based on this source. Lajbi ^{Holla @ me • CP} 12:00, 29 July 2013 (UTC)

I found two more (Slovene) sources that might come handy as his article lacks any information between the period 1930-1970. Here's one about him participating in a Ljubljana tournament in 1935 and that he represented Triest in 1937 against Ljubljana in an intercity team match. Lajbi ^{Holla @ me • CP} 16:33, 29 July 2013 (UTC)

Werner Voss

I am sorry that your experiences of the assessment process has been so bad. Hopefully I can help you a little bit on how to navigate the intricacies of the nomination process. It is really quite easy when you get the hang of it. It was absolutely never my intention to stop you nominating the article in any way. I thought you had forgotten about it which is why I removed the parameter.

The first problem seems to have come from when you first put the article up for A-Class review. You put the A-Class=current parameter into the Biography banner. The popup bit wouldn't have therefore popped up. When "A-Class=current" is in the Milhist template, you should see an additional line of text in the additional information section. The text is "This article is currently undergoing an A-Class review." The "currently undergoing" is a red hyperlink and takes you to this page. Once you've edited that page and added your reasons and comments, you then transclude it on the Milhist review page. The A-Class parameter is there at the moment so you should see it now.

I have found the review process to be a very useful process to refine articles so I hope you are not too discouraged and give it a try. If you have any questions about it then please let me know. Woody (talk) 21:55, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

George, I saw your comment on Woody's talk page after I noticed him re-adding "A-Class=current" to the Voss page. No-one is trying to refuse help, I'm afraid I didn't notice your follow-up comment after my so-called "useless" advice when you first asked me -- it was a busy week professionally and WP-wise. I stick by my suggestion that GAN might be preferable before ACR but if you want to go with ACR, no problem. Let me or Woody know how you go with this attempt (preferably as a new section at the bottom of my talk page, it'll be harder to miss)... ;-) Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 22:51, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Hi looks like the nomination is there, just needed some fixing in the heading area -- you might want to sign your name at the end of the nom statement though... ;-) Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 15:34, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

August 2013

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• Lieutenant '''Eduard Martynovich Pulpe''' 22 June 1880 - 2 August 1916) was a World War I [[flying ace]] credited with five aerial victories. He was a schoolteacher

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World War I Air Service Aero Squadrons

I saw your comments about the 28th Aero Squadron and I've taken your notes and put them on my to do list for updating the articles I've written. I'll be going back to them in a week or so, and if there are any other items that I've missed, please feel free to add them to the list User:Bwmoll3/sandbox. Warmest Regards Bwmoll3 (talk) 02:44, 12 August 2013 (UTC)

Hello, Georgejdorner. You have new messages at Bwmoll3's talk page.
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My famous "Synchronization gear" article!!

Thought you might be interested in this, as it has been brewing up for a long time and is now almost finished. I plan to be bold (to put it mildly) by pasting this lot straight over the existing "Interrupter gear" article, and then moving it to the new (more appropriate) title. I have used Australian spelling (the best and purest form of English, of course) with the notable exception of the word "synchronize" and its derivatives, which while not the preferred Australian spelling seems to be listed as "acceptable".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Soundofmusicals/sandbox

The main things still missing and/or obviously imperfect:

1. References - these are VERY thin on the ground at the moment - I have a large pile of books and serial articles all ready to go through the article improving this aspect - but I am waiting on this until the first draft of the new article is more or less complete. A few things might get changed or even deleted to fit what the sources say as the references (there will be a lot of them!) go in - but doing it this way round will make the article less derivative, while permitting it to avoid any hint of undesirable OR.

2. Post 1919 history of synchronized guns - I very simply can't find sources!! Although there must be some info somewhere, after all they went on synchronizing guns to fire through the propeller well into the fifties!

Your comments would be very welcome.

ISBN

The International Standard Book Number is a means of identifying production and sources for published material. From approximately 1968–2007, ISBN-10 (a 10-digit number) was in effect. After that point, due to the proliferation of new titles, only ISBN=-13 (13-digit) codes were used. In some cases, books appear with both coding systems in place but gradually, except for older volumes that are not re-designated, only ISBN-13 applies. Prior to 1968, no codes were applied and even after that point, the use of ISBN-10 was not standard throughout the publishing industry. There are still occasions when you can pick up an older book and find only ISBN-10, going to publishers' data, and you will find only the older coding as it was unlikely that the older book will be re-issued. If it was, then ISBN-13 would apply after 2007. Then there is ISSN! FWiW Bzuk (talk) 16:57, 16 August 2013 (UTC)

H.G=

George,

I gave the full citation originally. Can you re-read that edit, then revisit me here and tell me exactly how it is 'vague'? You seemed to understand it perfectly, so I don't think was George, was it? A tad disingenuous I must say.

Kilduff does not offer a conclusive score - he merely takes the reader through the likely result of each claim. He and at least two others have conclusively ruled out two claims, so I'm afraid it makes a nonsense of 22 'confirmed victories', a term which should be kicked out of these articles altogether. I don't really care what you think the definition of a "confirmed victory" should be, to be frank, and neither is this about what methods each service used to decide upon them in the FWW or any other conflict. Confirmed victory implies no doubt and inescapable proof given. There is doubt. Its continued use is an insult to ones intelligence and is entirely misleading to the lay reader, for whom this article is written. From what I'm hearing your argument is this; "A confirmed victory is a kill credited to a pilot by the standards of ones own service, but may not actually be a victory at all". That is a mouthful, and probably why us 'ignorant' WWII enthusiasts stick to clear, if simplistic terms. At least the casual reader won't be led down the garden path.

That said, it maybe a relief for you to know that I'm resigning my interest in this article, since I don't have the time to spare here anymore. All the best. Dapi89 (talk) 23:59, 18 August 2013 (UTC)

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Yes, you did give a full citation referring to a source not listed in the article bibliography. And yes, I did take the bother to try to trace that source for you in an attempt to salvage your edit—something that probably no other editor would do. And yes, I failed to find it using the information given, discovering only that it is in some book or another by Peter Kilduff. Full citations don't fail that way. Yours did.

It may surprise you to discover that I share your attitude toward aerial victories. However, the number of victories an ace is credited with is about the first thing readers want to know. The sources used for writing about World War I aces rely on the term "confirmed victories". You may hate the term, but, to give an example, when a victorious World War I pilot retrieved souvenirs from the wreckage of his victim or the corpse of his enemy, a victory is definitely confirmed. Thus, your imputation that no aerial victories were ever confirmed is obviously false. I could add some further similar examples, but am not to embarrass you.

However, I must admit that "A confirmed victory is a kill credited to a pilot by the standards of ones own service, but may not actually be a victory at all" is not a bad summation of the process of reporting all aerial victories, regardless of conflict; there are no neutral referees keeping score. In fact, I would add that any other approach is leading the casual reader down that agricultural byway. Certainly, when I read about an aerial victory by a World War II aviator, I can have no idea what is entailed. Was it verified by gun camera? Or was the victim's wreckage found afterwards? Or were there independent witnesses? Or was it just a case of the pilot returning to base and saying, "I shot at him, and he dived into the clouds below, so I know I got him"? That is why I placed a request (thus far ignored) for an article on Aerial victory standards of World War II. And that is why I made the remarks I did about the lack of foundation for the World War II articles that refer to aerial victories. Without that missing article, the editors in the World War II aviation niche literally do not know what they are writing about.

Georgejdorner (talk) 01:15, 19 August 2013 (UTC)

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George, I have no reason to feel embarrassed but you do. At the third time of asking, review my initial edits and you will see it was added to the bibliography. If you can't get that simple fact right, what hope is there for resolving this issue?

George, 'confirmed victories' cannot exist in list form. Your example is rather woeful; you've simply given me a couple of instances where a victory can be proven. How does this help us? Confirming one victory by the said means is not the same as stating a pilot achieved '22 confirmed victories' - the implication being the German (and possibly opposing side) were able to verify all of them. Evidently the proof was not provided. It is difficult to confirm one let alone 22. 'Confirmed victories' on this scale cannot exist so it isn't a false statement and you have caused no embarrassment to me.

Finally, I always make an effort to use the word "claim" or "was credited with" in the lead. A reader can be under no misconception then about the term "air victory" wherever it appears. I haven't seen a WII article with 'confirmed victories' for some time. I would say those minority articles should be re-worded, but then again I don't edit them. Perhaps now you can understand what "aerial victory" means. Besides, I could pose the same question about "confirmed victory" - camera film? wreckage? a corpse? Surely one cannot say Hermann shot down 22 'confirmed' victories - since there is no evidence of 22 separate confirmations. A rather uncomfortable fact for all aces.

I commend your efforts over there, but I really don't think its us (the WII 'ignorants') that are misunderstanding the point. Dapi89 (talk) 17:47, 19 August 2013 (UTC)

Hi George.

It is the word itself more than anything. The person(s) who slung that phrase together in the first place and used it to express a claim granted to them by their air service - which is what it is - should have been shot for their stupidity in my humble opinion. Personally I'll insist on using claim or credited with in the articles I do. I am going to, and do, make efforts with pilots' articles to produce a victory table - filled out as much as possible. I think that is an even more effective step in the right direction. I can then say; claim made, no evidence, possibly a victory, or a dead cert'. Until next time, all the best. Dapi89 (talk) 17:07, 22 August 2013 (UTC)

It is George, thanks. It still massively irritates me, but I could live with that on FWW articles - but SWW, given what we know about over-claiming and so forth, I couldn't see myself putting it in. Regards. Dapi89 (talk) 11:08, 24 August 2013 (UTC)

Voss

I think it is better practice to document them on the review page. This way all reviewers have the option to comment on whether the info needs to be included prior to supporting A-class. MisterBee1966 (talk) 15:50, 19 August 2013 (UTC)

Thanks! Nicely done MisterBee1966 (talk) 13:26, 16 September 2013 (UTC)

September 2013

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Fixed.Georgejdorner (talk) 15:55, 16 September 2013 (UTC)

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Fixed.Georgejdorner (talk) 15:56, 16 September 2013 (UTC)

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WikiProject Military history coordinator election

Greetings from WikiProject Military history! As a member of the project, you are invited to take part in our annual project coordinator election, which will determine our coordinators for the next twelve months. If you wish to cast a vote, please do so on the election page by 23:59 (UTC) on 28 September! Kirill ^[talk] 16:45, 16 September 2013 (UTC)

I have done a bold merge!!

The old "CC gear" article promised to be very comprehensive, although what was completed of it was very "word-for-word" from the source! The main point is that it hadn't been worked on for a good while, and was very little use in its current form - so I have merged it to the relevant section of the new synchronization gear article. Having done it, do you think I am right? I have written diplomatically (I hope) to the editor who started the article concerned. --Soundofmusicals (talk) 11:23, 20 September 2013 (UTC)

Werner Voss

George, you are under the mistaken belief that the templates you were employing were providing a positive improvement to the listing of bibliographic notations. I struggled with trying to adapt your templates to output the proper coding but each time, you went and made another error. Regardless of the hours you may have spent in trying to wrangle the bibliography into a sensible order, you undid all the hours I had spent in creating an accurate bibliographic file. What I had laid out was the exact bibliographic record according to the style guide of the Modern Language Association (MLA) Style Guide that is the most commonly used format to cite sources for the liberal arts and humanities, including history and biography topics, which is what the Werner Voss article represents. When Wikipedia decided to have a template system provided to assist non-experts in sourcing material, they chose the simpler, American Psychological Association (APA) style guide which is a commonly used system for science and business, but certainly not for the wider range of non-fiction publications such as historical works. When APA was first introduced, it was taught at universities as a "dumbed" down system but one that was easier to use. There are lots of advantages to using a template but citing complex sources is not one of them. The use of the Chicago style and Turabian is also used for research papers, but are adaptions of the MLA style. If you wish to know more about referencing materials, I can provide some additional background as my work as a reference librarian and cataloger, and lately, editor for publication houses, over the last 33 years + involved all manner of cataloging and referencing, FWiW Bzuk (talk) 12:36, 23 September 2013 (UTC)

You may also recognize that citation templates are neither sanctioned, approved nor required for Wikipedia editors. Many experienced users do not employ templates, as they can cause just as much harm as good, under the old computer dictum of "garbage in, garbage out". FWiW Bzuk (talk) 12:40, 23 September 2013 (UTC)

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During my A Class Review, I received some very strong hints that I had better change this citation system if I wanted Werner Voss to progress to Featured Article status. I was attempting to teach myself the wikicode to do so when you destroyed my work. If you had told me the cites were incorrect, I could have copied them back to my workspace, restored the old cites, and continued my struggle to learn wikiediting. As it is, you are just the latest editor to destroy my attempts at teaching myself wiki markup.

Georgejdorner (talk) 00:51, 24 September 2013 (UTC)

Then you need to use WP:SANDBOX or a sandbox in your userspace to learn, you should not be teaching yourself wikimarkup for templates in articlespace, speaking honestly - because it leads to broken articles and reverts such as has happened here. As (from your words) multiple editors have "destroy[ed] my attempts at teaching myself wiki markup", then you need to consider that perhaps the method you are using to teach yourself is causing issues and, therefore, you need to do it on a sandbox page to avoid this issue. - The Bushranger _{One ping only} 01:00, 24 September 2013 (UTC)

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Then you need to actually read my above post, where I state I was in workspace. The difficulty came during my transfer of the results into the article. You also ignored my offer to unilaterally restore the old version after saving my work.

The only issue I see here is your lack of good faith in a fellow editor, inattention to what is actually written, and a tendency to lecture.

Georgejdorner (talk) 01:50, 24 September 2013 (UTC)

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Talkback

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October 2013

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• of continuing on to neutral Switzerland, he returned to Germany to enter military service.{cn}}

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• * [[:Category:American World War I flying aces|List of World War I aces from the United States]] (incomplete}

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Groupe de Combat 11 (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver)

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Congratulations!

		Military history reviewers' award
		By order of the Military history WikiProject coordinators, for your good work helping with the WikiProject's good article, Peer, A-Class and Featured Article reviews for the period July-September 2013, I hereby award you this Military history WikiProject Reviewers' award. AustralianRupert (talk) 06:12, 10 October 2013 (UTC) Keep track of upcoming reviews. Just copy and paste {{WPMILHIST Review alerts}} to your user space

Enemy ace

If you've got sourcing to back up the missing names on the Brit & U.S. aces lists, add them there. Or post the fact on the respective talk pages. Putting it with the cats is unhelpful. TREKphiler ^{any time you're ready, Uhura} 01:07, 11 October 2013 (UTC)

I don't disagree, but posting a notice of incompleteness in conjunction with the cats on the main list page isn't accomplishing anything. A posting on the talk pages at least has a chance of attracting more information & sourcing. It's also usual practise. What you've done could be considered vandalism. TREKphiler ^{any time you're ready, Uhura} 05:49, 11 October 2013 (UTC)

I'm not disagreeing with you, as I've said. And I applaud the effort. As for whether it could be considered vandalism, yeah, it can. It's adding junk text on a page, rather than posting warning comments on the appropriate talk pages, which, as said, is the correct approach. It's well-intentioned, but if it keeps happening, it's going to get you smacked for being disruptive. Somebody's not going to see it the same way I do--& certainly somebody won't see it the same way you do. TREKphiler ^{any time you're ready, Uhura} 19:51, 11 October 2013 (UTC)

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Talk:Raemer Schreiber/GA1

George, you opened this review on October 6 with a single comment, and haven't continued in over two weeks. Are you planning to finish the review soon? Or would you prefer that we return it to the reviewing pool? Please let us know. Many thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 01:06, 24 October 2013 (UTC)

Where are we up to with this? Hawkeye7 (talk) 07:43, 2 November 2013 (UTC)

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Congratulations

Hi George. Congratulations on the Albert Ball article being promoted at FAC! I've left a follow-up message on Ian's talk page as well. I'm sorry I wasn't able to get back again in time, but I agree with what he said at that FAC. You've put an immense amount of work into this over the years and the article is excellent. Carcharoth (talk) 15:24, 3 November 2013 (UTC)

WikiCup 2014

Hi, if you haven't already, you should consider signing up for WikiCup 2014. Cheers, --Sp33dyphil ©^hat_ontributions 02:18, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

The Half Barnstar

		The Half Barnstar
		On behalf of the article's future audience, I award Georgejdorner The Half Barnstar for going the extra mile to help promote Albert Ball to FA status. Thank you for your collaborative effort with Ian Rose. Cheers, --Sp33dyphil ©hatontributions 07:40, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

Just a quick note to congratulate you on the promotion of Albert Ball to FA status recently. If you would like to see this (or any other FA you may have helped to write) appear as "Today's featured article" soon, please nominate it at the requests page; if you'd like to see an FA on a particular date in the next year or so, please add it to the "pending" list. In the absence of a request, the article may end up being picked at any time (although with 1,336 articles in Category:Featured articles that have not appeared on the main page at present, there's no telling how long – or short! – the wait might be). If you'd got any TFA-related questions or problems, please let me know. Thanks, Bencherlite^Talk 11:09, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

Italicizing titles

Hi George, and thanks for creating Escadrille SPA.57. Just so you know, wiki markup doesn't usually work in titles. If you want an article to be italicized, just add {{italic title}} in the article itself. In this case, I don't think the title really needs to be italicized, though. We have an article Escadrille where it it's italicized inconsistently. I've de-italicized the name in your article, but if you'd prefer it that way, I wouldn't object to you changing it back. If you do, you'll want to add {{italic title}} so the title displays that was as well. Thanks, BDD (talk) 20:37, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

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Fixed.Georgejdorner (talk) 15:04, 16 November 2013 (UTC)

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Fixed.Georgejdorner (talk) 15:16, 16 November 2013 (UTC)

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Probables

Would "unconfirmed" or another term be a better word? Let me know, would be more than happy to make the article better Bwmoll3 (talk) 15:51, 16 November 2013 (UTC)

November 2013

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• | Captain Alwayne Travers Loyd, of [ who was killed.<ref name=Lines/><ref>Aerodrome listing for Loyd [http://www.theaerodrome.com/aces/

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List of World War I flying aces from France (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver)

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Fixed.Georgejdorner (talk) 19:18, 23 November 2013 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Original Barnstar
	Thanks a lot for putting together bio pages for World War I aces - I believe that one of them is my relative Vasili Yanchenko and I wanted to get in touch with you to ask a question if you don't mind. Nbn1982 (talk) 20:57, 26 November 2013 (UTC)

Berthold ACR

G'day, George, I think you might have been having some trouble creating the ACR for Rudolf Berthold so I created the page for you. It can be found here: Wikipedia:WikiProject Military history/Assessment/Rudolf Berthold. If that wasn't your intent, please let me know and I will try to rectify my mistake. Take care. Regards, AustralianRupert (talk) 23:38, 30 November 2013 (UTC)

December 2013

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Fixed.Georgejdorner (talk) 16:02, 4 December 2013 (UTC)

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Murder of Dwayne Jones GAR

Much appreciated George! All the best, Midnightblueowl (talk) 18:15, 8 December 2013 (UTC)

List of World War I aces credited with 5 victories

I left some remarks to address before I can support your nomination. Good progress so far MisterBee1966 (talk) 20:44, 10 December 2013 (UTC)

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Don't give up

Review process for high level ratings like A-class and FA-class do have a tendency to get long and frustrating, but it would be unwise to throw in the towel and leave Wikipedia altogether. I would implore you to reconsider your position, and if you need it, I would be willing to do what I can to help out with your nominated list. TomStar81 (Talk) 07:38, 12 December 2013 (UTC)

ditto to above, George. I'll help out too. MrBee is a very good and very thorough reviewer and I've been on the receiving end of his analysis. Hang in there. If there are no sources, there are no sources. We'll work it out.  :) auntieruth (talk) 23:56, 12 December 2013 (UTC)

Hi George, I regret your decision and I truly feel instrumentally at fault for this situation. Please reconsider, you have added so much to Wikipedia. Cheers MisterBee1966 (talk) 09:25, 17 December 2013 (UTC)

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If you folks ever develop a written checklist(s) of A-List, A-Class, Featured Article, and Featured List requirements that can be referred to, I would give serious consideration to returning because I could pre-edit my work. However, I am not about to undergo any more "assessments via ambush".

The last assessment I was involved made no changes perceptible to our reader. For this, I spent five years accumulating data to ensure a complete list, and a month's unsuccessful monkeying with code.Georgejdorner (talk) 18:03, 17 December 2013 (UTC)

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George, Wikipedia is fundamentally based on the voluntary contribution of free and available cognitive capacity. Conceptually it is an evolutionary ecosystem, the information and expectations it holds morph over time. Nothing is static in Wikipedia, neither the articles nor the criteria against which they are written. Your most recent feedback "Assessment by ambush" gives me the impression that you feel unfairly treated, either by the reviewers, in particular me, or by the system itself. When I reviewed your article I believe to have echoed the experience and knowledge I gathered over the time I have contributed to Wikipedia. Wikipedia is an evolutionary process which if you want to participate is better served from the inside than the outside. The lesson learned here is that we all have to embrace the fact that helping each other write and contribute to Wikipedia should be an enjoyable experience, which in the end is in benefit for all. MisterBee1966 (talk) 08:55, 18 December 2013 (UTC)

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"Assessment by ambush" is basically an unfair system of random requirements, for which the newbie cannot prepare. If the excuse for not codifying requirements is that they are constantly evolving, well, so are Wikipedia's articles. If the articles can be written down subject to change, so can the checklist.

Right now, the assessment system is swamped. A checklist would help alleviate that problem. Reading through the checklist would give pause to the unprepared, and delay nominations that are bound to fail until they are truly ready. The actual assessments that are nominated could be processed much more quickly. Better prepared nominations would lessen the assessors' work loads, and speed up the assessment process. Cripes, assessments might even become sort of fun.

And, Mr. Bee, we do agree that writing for WP should be enjoyable. That's why I moved on when it became unenjoyable.

Georgejdorner (talk) 19:56, 18 December 2013 (UTC)

Good Tidings and all that ...

FWiW Bzuk (talk) 19:28, 23 December 2013 (UTC)

Congratulations

		The Military history A-Class Medal with Oak Leaves
		On behalf of the co-ordinators of the Military History Wikiproject, I am pleased to present you with this A-Class Medal to recognise that work that you have done in bringing Roderic Dallas, Albert Ball, and List of World War I aces credited with 5 victories to A-Class status. Thank you for your contributions to the encyclopedia. Congratulations! Ian Rose (talk) 22:29, 2 January 2014 (UTC)