Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Cornwall: Difference between revisions
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== Proposed county infobox template change == |
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== Parishes project == |
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A discussion is ongoing at [[Template talk:Infobox English county#Proposal: remove the ethnicity section]] which is likely of interest to this project. The original proposal is for straight removal of the ethnicity field from the template but keeping the population field. A modification to the proposal seeks the addition of two optional, undefined statistical fields within the non-metropolitan and unitary authority sections of the county infoboxes — at present there are no demographic statistical fields, other than population under these headings. [[User:Rupples|Rupples]] ([[User talk:Rupples|talk]]) 23:14, 14 December 2023 (UTC) |
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I have started a project for missing civil parishes at [[User:Crouch, Swale/Missing parishes]]. The missing parishes in Cornwall are: |
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== Standard Written Form label == |
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* <s>[[St Buryan, Lamorna and Paul]]</s> |
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* <s>[[St Ive and Pensilva]]</s> |
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* [[St Keyne and Trewidland]] |
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* [[Tregony with Cuby]] |
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Hi, just noticed on a few articles such as [[Bodmin Moor]] and [[Land's End]] that it displayed the standard Cornish name with just "[[Standard Written Form]]", e.g. {{tqb|'''Land's End''' ([[Standard Written Form]]: ''Penn an Wlas'' or ''Pedn an Wlas'') is a}} but as discussed at the SWF page itself, the title is quite vague and did not make me think of Cornish first. So I boldly altered it to "[[Cornish language|Cornish]] [[Standard Written Form]]", is this re-wording acceptable? I raise it here as it seemed to be more widespread than initially thought (i.e. at [[Padstow]]), so asking before I come across any more. Would prefer "Standard Cornish" unless it is incorrect to refer SWF as such. |
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And these exists as a redirect only but should probably have separate articles: |
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* [[Budock]] (?), is this an alternative name for [[Budock Water]]? |
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* [[Lawhitton Rural]] |
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* [[St Minver Highlands]] |
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* [[St Minver Lowlands]] |
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A total of 8, see [[User:Crouch, Swale/Missing parishes (1)#Cornwall]]. '''[[User:Crouch, Swale|<span style="color:Green">Crouch, Swale</span>]]''' ([[User talk:Crouch, Swale|<span style="color:Blue">talk</span>]]) 20:26, 26 October 2021 (UTC) |
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*:I've struct the created 1, pinging active members to get more input {{ping|Balin42632003|Cdjp1|DuncanHill|Esmost|Flappy Pigeon|Gazamp|Geertivp|Geof Sheppard|Highfields|Johnsoniensis|Jowaninpensans|LessHeard vanU|Moonraker|Peterwill|Plutonium27|Raintheone|Steinsky|Talskiddy|Tewdar|Theroadislong|Vernon39|Worm That Turned|Zangar}}. '''[[User:Crouch, Swale|<span style="color:Green">Crouch, Swale</span>]]''' ([[User talk:Crouch, Swale|<span style="color:Blue">talk</span>]]) 18:17, 30 January 2022 (UTC) |
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**St Minver Highlands and St Minver Lowlands civil parishes definitely need their own articles... [[User:Tewdar|<span style='font-family:"sans-serif";color:#cfb53b;background-color:#000000;'><b> Tewdar </b></span>]]([[User talk:Tewdar|talk]]) 20:31, 30 January 2022 (UTC) |
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**[[Tregony with Cuby]] is simply a very recent combination of the parish councils of [[Tregony]] and [[Cuby, Cornwall|Cuby]]. Probably both of them are still civil parishes, even though those pages say they aren’t. Tregony with Cuby has almost zero history and might struggle to be notable. [[St Keyne]] and [[Trewidland]] is much the same. [[User:Moonraker|Moonraker]] ([[User talk:Moonraker|talk]]) 21:34, 30 January 2022 (UTC) |
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***{{Ping|Moonraker}} The CPs were merged in April last year, see [https://s3-eu-west-2.amazonaws.com/lgbce/Resources/Local%20Government%20Orders/South%20West/Cornwall/Reorganisation%20of%20Community%20Governance%20No%201%20Order%202020.pdf this] order and the OS[https://data.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/doc/7000000000180851][https://data.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/doc/7000000000180846]. The history and distinction is the distinct name and recent merge. There's a reason [[Wokingham]]/[[Borough of Wokingham]] are separate articles but [[Reading, Berkshire]]/[[Borough of Reading]] aren't. The former is a relatively recent (1974) combination while Reading's boundaries are much older, see [[Wikipedia talk:WikiProject UK geography/Archive/WikiProject UK subdivisions#Splits where borough is smaller than urban area]]. '''[[User:Crouch, Swale|<span style="color:Green">Crouch, Swale</span>]]''' ([[User talk:Crouch, Swale|<span style="color:Blue">talk</span>]]) 21:45, 30 January 2022 (UTC) |
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****{{U|Crouch, Swale}}, those are good sources, and the first shows that Cornwall Council did indeed use its powers to combine the civil parishes. It didn’t have to do that, as it could also have created what are called joint parish councils, with more than one civil parish in them. You have cleared that point up, but mine stands, viz. that if these pages were created there would be little to go in them! Not that I am against it, but of limited value. [[User:Moonraker|Moonraker]] ([[User talk:Moonraker|talk]]) 23:02, 30 January 2022 (UTC) |
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Meur ras '''[[User:DankJae|<span style="color: black">Dank</span>]][[User talk:DankJae|<span style="color: red">Jae</span>]]''' 04:13, 1 January 2024 (UTC) |
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== User script to detect unreliable sources == |
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:Tbh I probably wasn't clear, just saying, that with no opposition so far, I may change the "Standard Written Form" to "Cornish Standard Written Form", or maybe "Standard Cornish" now I think about it, in leads. I don't know a lot of Cornish, so just wanted to ask before! '''[[User:DankJae|<span style="color: black">Dank</span>]][[User talk:DankJae|<span style="color: red">Jae</span>]]''' 01:42, 15 January 2024 (UTC) |
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{{Main|User:Headbomb/unreliable}} |
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::Standard Cornish is a totally different orthography from the Standard Written Form. The Standard Written Form has two official forms used by Cornwall Council, SWF (Middle) and SWF (Late), hence the two forms for Land's End, Penn an Wlas - SWF (M) and Pedn an Wlas - (SWF (L). 'Cornish SWF' or 'Cornish Standard Written Form' would be the two best choices. [[User:Brwynog|Brwynog]] ([[User talk:Brwynog|talk]]) 18:39, 12 March 2024 (UTC) |
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I have (with the help of others) made a small user script to detect and highlight various links to [[WP:URS|unreliable sources]] and [[predatory journal]]s. Some of you may already be familiar with it, given it is currently the [[Wikipedia:User scripts/Most imported scripts|39th most imported script on Wikipedia]]. The idea is that it takes something like |
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*John Smith "[https://www.deprecated.com/article Article of things]" ''Deprecated.com''. Accessed 2020-02-14. (<code><nowiki>John Smith "[https://www.deprecated.com/article Article of things]" ''Deprecated.com''. Accessed 2020-02-14.</nowiki></code>) |
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:::Ok, noted. I may have done it once forgot where. Will use "Cornish Standard Written Form" (/SWF) going forward. '''[[User:DankJae|<span style="color: black">Dank</span>]][[User talk:DankJae|<span style="color: red">Jae</span>]]''' 15:35, 28 March 2024 (UTC) |
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and turns it into something like |
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* John Smith "{{highlight|[https://www.deprecated.com/article Article of things]|pink}}" ''Deprecated.com''. Accessed 2020-02-14. |
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It will work on a variety of links, including those from {{tl|cite web}}, {{tl|cite journal}} and {{tl|doi}}. |
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An RfC has been opened at [[Talk:Cornwall#RfC on including the Cornish flag in the infobox|Talk:Cornwall]] about ncluding the Cornish flag in the article infobox. Please contribute if you would like to do so. [[User:A.D.Hope|A.D.Hope]] ([[User talk:A.D.Hope|talk]]) 10:06, 19 February 2024 (UTC) |
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The script is mostly based on [[WP:RSPSOURCES]], [[WP:NPPSG]] and [[WP:CITEWATCH]] and a good dose of common sense. I'm always expanding coverage and tweaking the script's logic, so general feedback and suggestions to expand coverage to other unreliable sources are always welcomed. |
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== Good article reassessment for [[South West Coast Path]] == |
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Do note that this is '''not a script to be mindlessly used''', and several caveats apply. Details and instructions are available at [[User:Headbomb/unreliable]]. Questions, comments and requests can be made at [[User talk:Headbomb/unreliable]]. |
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[[South West Coast Path]] has been nominated for a good article reassessment. If you are interested in the discussion, please participate by adding your comments to the [[Wikipedia:Good article reassessment/South West Coast Path/1|reassessment page]]. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, the good article status may be removed from the article. [[User:AirshipJungleman29|~~ AirshipJungleman29]] ([[User talk:AirshipJungleman29|talk]]) 00:10, 2 March 2024 (UTC) |
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== Requested move at [[Talk:Saint Piran's Flag#Requested move 19 February 2024]] == |
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-  <span style="font-variant:small-caps; whitespace:nowrap;">[[User:Headbomb|Headbomb]] {[[User talk:Headbomb|t]] · [[Special:Contributions/Headbomb|c]] · [[WP:PHYS|p]] · [[WP:WBOOKS|b]]}</span> |
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[[File:Information.svg|30px|left]] There is a requested move discussion at [[Talk:Saint Piran's Flag#Requested move 19 February 2024]] that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. [[User:ModernDayTrilobite|ModernDayTrilobite]] ([[User talk:ModernDayTrilobite|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/ModernDayTrilobite|contribs]]) 16:42, 7 March 2024 (UTC) |
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<span style="font-size:90%">This is a one time notice and can't be unsubscribed from.</span> Delivered by: [[User:MediaWiki message delivery|MediaWiki message delivery]] ([[User talk:MediaWiki message delivery|talk]]) 16:01, 29 April 2022 (UTC) |
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<!-- Message sent by User:Terasail@enwiki using the list at https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User:Headbomb/sandbox3&oldid=1085285969 --> |
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== Isles of Scilly taskforce? == |
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Hello, just some newbie here to enquire: Would it be possible to have an Isles of Scilly Taskforce as part of the Cornwall WikiProject? No worries if not, I just want to see if there is any enthusiasm from the WikiProject members. [[User:HenryTemplo|HenryTemplo]] ([[User talk:HenryTemplo|talk]]) 11:30, 2 May 2022 (UTC) |
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:I have done a bit of editing on the IoS articles in the past and willing to help, but I haven't really been that active on here recently and I can't guarantee I can spare much time. [[User:Bodrugan|Bodrugan]] ([[User talk:Bodrugan|talk]]) 10:04, 16 May 2022 (UTC) |
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::Thanks for your reply, @[[User:Bodrugan|Bodrugan]]! Judging from the otherwise lack of responses, I don’t think there’s a huge demand for a IoS Task Force, although I will certainly continue my editing of Scilly-related pages. I’m hoping (at some point) to get the Isles of Scilly article promoted to good article status... when I get round to it! Have a great day! [[User:HenryTemplo|HenryTemplo]] ([[User talk:HenryTemplo|talk]]) 10:14, 16 May 2022 (UTC) |
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== Penwith == |
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The [[Penwith]] article seems very confusing and out of date. It's trying to cover the now defunct district of Penwith, but also West Penwith/the Penwith peninsula and completely ignores most of East Penwith (The areas around Camborne and Redruth). The district covered the western two thirds of the old Hundred of Penwith, and doesn't really match up with the geographical area of the Penwith peninsula or West Penwith as it included areas around Hayle. I think we need a separate article on the old district council, as there is for the hundred, and the article on Penwith should encompass the whole thing (West Penwith, East Penwith and the former district) or just become a disambiguation page and create pages for West Penwith and the district. [[User:Bodrugan|Bodrugan]] ([[User talk:Bodrugan|talk]]) 10:20, 16 May 2022 (UTC) |
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== List of foreign-language names for Cornwall == |
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This page was merged into [[Geography of Cornwall]] in 2009, but more recently all of the information on this subject was removed from that page, meaning the redirect doesn't take you to the information any more. Can we find a more suitable home for the list and redirect? [[User:Bodrugan|Bodrugan]] ([[User talk:Bodrugan|talk]]) 14:11, 24 May 2022 (UTC) |
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We have a guideline ([[Wikipedia:WikiProject Cornwall/Guideline]]) for article leads on the '''Cornwall - England - United Kingdom''' issue, but could we also have one for biographies of [[Cornish people]] on the use of Cornish as a nationality in leads? [[User:Bodrugan|Bodrugan]] ([[User talk:Bodrugan|talk]]) 10:45, 25 May 2022 (UTC) |
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:I think that would be a good idea, do you want to draft one up in your userspace? Any interested editor can then chip in if they want to and comment on it. Have a great day! [[User:HenryTemplo|HenryTemplo]] ([[User talk:HenryTemplo|talk]]) 11:16, 25 May 2022 (UTC) |
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:Fully support this, this is very important. [[User:Gwikor Frank|Gwikor Frank]] ([[User talk:Gwikor Frank|talk]]) 22:38, 27 May 2022 (UTC) |
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*[[WP:NATIONALITY]]. "The opening paragraph should usually provide context for the activities that made the person notable. In most modern-day cases, this will be the country, region, or territory, where the person is a citizen, national, or permanent resident; or, if the person is notable mainly for past events, where the person was a citizen, national, or permanent resident when the person became notable. For guidance on historic place name versus modern-day names, see WP:MODERNPLACENAME. |
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:Ethnicity, religion, or sexuality should generally not be in the lead unless it is relevant to the subject's notability. Similarly, previous nationalities or the place of birth should not be mentioned in the lead unless relevant to the subject's notability". [[User:DuncanHill|DuncanHill]] ([[User talk:DuncanHill|talk]]) 22:53, 27 May 2022 (UTC) |
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::There is an exception for nationalities within the UK. Why the UK in particular gets this I don't really understand, but that's the way it is. Note that it's not based on "countries of the United Kingdom" (this would result in Welsh people between 1746 and 1967 being labelled as English) so the policy should be read as being inclusive of the Cornish, unless Wikipedia wants to discriminate against the Cornish in particular. [[User:Bodrugan|Bodrugan]] ([[User talk:Bodrugan|talk]]) 20:33, 6 June 2022 (UTC) |
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:::Editors should bear in mind that a large proportion of people in Cornwall regard themselves as either English (i.e. that Cornwall is a part of England), or both English and Cornish. Not all, of course, but (like it or not) a substantial proportion. [[User:Ghmyrtle|Ghmyrtle]] ([[User talk:Ghmyrtle|talk]]) 21:10, 6 June 2022 (UTC) |
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::::Ideally, we would need some data to back this up (and some reliable sources), so maybe why should wait until the result of the 2022 census comes out this summer, which should give us some idea on the preferred nationality of Cornish people (and maybe some RS will publish some articles as well). Just a idea... [[User:HenryTemplo|HenryTemplo]] ([[User talk:HenryTemplo|talk]]) 07:08, 7 June 2022 (UTC) |
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::::Yes, that's perfectly true. What I'm encountering is that biographies of Cornish people, who may not have seen themselves as English, are being edited and changed to describe them as ''English'' (rather than British) using the above policy to justify it. What I would suggest is that all nationalities in opening paragraphs for people born in Cornwall should read ''British'', unless a Cornish identity was part of that person's notability, or we have evidence that that person identified themselves as ''Cornish'', or indeed ''English'' (and any other identity). [[User:Bodrugan|Bodrugan]] ([[User talk:Bodrugan|talk]]) 14:54, 8 June 2022 (UTC) |
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:::::[Just to clarify, @[[User:Bodrugan|Bodrugan]], I'm not saying we use the census to cite wether someone identifies as Cornish, just that the census will probably lead to reliable sources publishing articles about Cornish identity, given any discussion on Wikipedia about Cornish identity some basis and data (my fault for rushing to write that reply!)] Yes, I think that approach would probably be appropriate, given that Cornish identity can be a controversial issue. Might be worth checking though what's the latest consensus and precedent on the matter. :) [[User:HenryTemplo|HenryTemplo]] ([[User talk:HenryTemplo|talk]]) 16:19, 9 June 2022 (UTC) |
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This page has archives. Sections older than 30 days may be automatically archived by Lowercase sigmabot III. |
Proposed county infobox template change[edit]
A discussion is ongoing at Template talk:Infobox English county#Proposal: remove the ethnicity section which is likely of interest to this project. The original proposal is for straight removal of the ethnicity field from the template but keeping the population field. A modification to the proposal seeks the addition of two optional, undefined statistical fields within the non-metropolitan and unitary authority sections of the county infoboxes — at present there are no demographic statistical fields, other than population under these headings. Rupples (talk) 23:14, 14 December 2023 (UTC)
Standard Written Form label[edit]
Hi, just noticed on a few articles such as Bodmin Moor and Land's End that it displayed the standard Cornish name with just "Standard Written Form", e.g.
Land's End (Standard Written Form: Penn an Wlas or Pedn an Wlas) is a
but as discussed at the SWF page itself, the title is quite vague and did not make me think of Cornish first. So I boldly altered it to "Cornish Standard Written Form", is this re-wording acceptable? I raise it here as it seemed to be more widespread than initially thought (i.e. at Padstow), so asking before I come across any more. Would prefer "Standard Cornish" unless it is incorrect to refer SWF as such.
Meur ras DankJae 04:13, 1 January 2024 (UTC)
- Tbh I probably wasn't clear, just saying, that with no opposition so far, I may change the "Standard Written Form" to "Cornish Standard Written Form", or maybe "Standard Cornish" now I think about it, in leads. I don't know a lot of Cornish, so just wanted to ask before! DankJae 01:42, 15 January 2024 (UTC)
- Standard Cornish is a totally different orthography from the Standard Written Form. The Standard Written Form has two official forms used by Cornwall Council, SWF (Middle) and SWF (Late), hence the two forms for Land's End, Penn an Wlas - SWF (M) and Pedn an Wlas - (SWF (L). 'Cornish SWF' or 'Cornish Standard Written Form' would be the two best choices. Brwynog (talk) 18:39, 12 March 2024 (UTC)
- Definitely don't use 'Standard Cornish'. Tewdar 19:08, 12 March 2024 (UTC)
- Ok, noted. I may have done it once forgot where. Will use "Cornish Standard Written Form" (/SWF) going forward. DankJae 15:35, 28 March 2024 (UTC)
RfC on Cornish flag[edit]
An RfC has been opened at Talk:Cornwall about ncluding the Cornish flag in the article infobox. Please contribute if you would like to do so. A.D.Hope (talk) 10:06, 19 February 2024 (UTC)
Good article reassessment for South West Coast Path[edit]
South West Coast Path has been nominated for a good article reassessment. If you are interested in the discussion, please participate by adding your comments to the reassessment page. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, the good article status may be removed from the article. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 00:10, 2 March 2024 (UTC)
Requested move at Talk:Saint Piran's Flag#Requested move 19 February 2024[edit]
There is a requested move discussion at Talk:Saint Piran's Flag#Requested move 19 February 2024 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. ModernDayTrilobite (talk • contribs) 16:42, 7 March 2024 (UTC)